A.J. Castellitto
A faithful Catholic and an agitated Protestant go at it!
By A.J. Castellitto
October 31, 2014

Catholic Guy: So... how do you get around Augustine and Aquinas's doctrinal adherence to, scriptural foundations for, and lived testimony to, things like the Eucharist, Mary, prayer to the saints, and purgatory?

Were they just smart about grace and idiots about the rest, or honest fools whose genius was real but not yet liberated from self-deception?

Protestant Guy (AJ): The same way I get around Luther and Calvin's adherence to perpetual virginity. It's their unique and faithful contributions and Biblical rediscoveries that should be lauded. I can show you where the Bible plainly says that Mary 'knew' Joseph in context and if you fail to accept the plain meaning, who has the problem? If pope is elevating some sketchy proclamations then be concerned with him, not my criticism. Blind adherence outside Jesus is foolishness. Aquinas may have followed luther right out the door for all we know???? RCC was the only game in town.....

If the pope does not stand tall and hard against the evils of our day he is an enemy. You can't hide behind the poor when sin and evil is rampant and souls are on the line. We need to speak out against atrocities perpetuated by secular authority; especially our religious leaders.

Christians are being butchered, kids are leaving the RCC in droves due to evolution, unbelief, religious humanism, the priest abuse scandal (from a few years back) and SSM. And this pope's priorities are all about minimizing the deep sin within us all and the evils we (sinful man) perpetuates. Your agitation is misplaced my brother. I hope to shake you out of your lethargy. I have some righteous anger to spare if you want some....

Catholic Guy: Agitation? Um... I just was asking an honest question, out of curiosity. I wasn't attacking what you wrote, just trying to understand better. I was just surprised to hear you mention Augustine and Aquinas in such high regard, that's all.....

Protestant Guy: Sometimes you got to kill the kindness to get to the crux of the problem. I'm not saying there is not some life in their churches. As long as the gospel is still preached and taught, there will be saved parishioners in the pews. But it's open season on all church leaders. This is war and we will continue to rage against those who speak falsehoods.

We need to hold fast to what we truly believe. The pope is my enemy. We can pretend to be on the same team, but if you stand with him you do not stand with me. We can't both be right. If you think what he's doing with the religious humanism-we all worship one god-stuff is righteous then you are not seeing where this is all headed. But I'm not going to pretend we are brothers in this. Know where you stand and stand your ground, but you can't ride the fence. You may think you can but soon you will see.....

Catholic Guy: Don't spout anymore nonsense about how you like or respect me or other individual Catholics or aren't trying to offend. I am tired of hearing how you don't think I am necessarily a bad guy or you think there are some lucky Catholics in the pews out there who might be saved, and then tell me that my friend who went to Sandy Hook to help didn't actually wipe up real blood, or my faith is secretly a cover to impose Islam on the world, or that what I teach the kids at my school OR THE CHILDREN IN MY HOME is satanic deception, or the fact that when I pray 'Catholic' prayers at the bedside of my dying friend or do a food drive or pray for peace in the Middle East that I should be garnering nothing more than a sympathetic look from you and a "aw, isn't that sweet, he's trying to be a real Christian."

When I ask you an honest question, you have to blast me with pedophilia, blind faith, corruption, and ask me when the last time I was in a real church was. You just posted elsewhere, and in very clear terms, that there is no point in arguing with you at your age because you will refuse to change – added to your pick-and-choose approach to the four religious leaders you cited, taking what you like from each to form your own infallible Christian theology – seems to me to be exactly what you accuse the RCC of; but that is for you to discern, and as you said, you will refuse to change in any event. I have prayed for you anytime you have asked; I have tried to be honest with you while respectful at the same time; I have OFTEN ignored ill-informed statements about my own faith simply because if you actually believe them, it seems hard to have a genuine discussion, which is what I would want. You are my brother in Christ, from my point of view; I will continue to pray for Christ's will do be done in your life and for His truth to be made manifest to you. I trust the sincerity of your own faith and I do sincerely ask for you to pray for both of those things for me, as often as you desire, because I need His grace at every moment. But to comment intelligently or coherently on posts which attack my faith while at the same time refusing to be open to discussion, and to cite scripture back at me while you are turning its pages with anger in one hand and conspiracy in the other, blocks our ability to be open to that grace and does absolutely nothing to 'wake me up' – much less to contribute to any friendship we might otherwise share. You have just said that I am your enemy; I do not see you the same way – but I do exhort you in Christ to follow our Master's command to love your enemy and pray for him, as I will surely benefit from His grace and am absolutely nothing without it. I will pray for you as well, but as my brother in Him. May His peace bring us both safe to His arms in Heaven someday, as well as our families.

Protestant Guy: I'm not gonna try to enlighten people who are hard against what I'm trying to show them!

Catholic Guy: More horse manure, AJ. If St. Augustine and Aquinas is wrong about the sacraments, Mary, the Church, purgatory, prayer to the saints, the Eucharist, you say, "Well, but I just filter out the things that are wrong and go with what they got right and still call them theological heroes." Same with Calvin. But if Pope Francis (or any other Catholic) is right about some stuff, that is immaterial because he is lying about Christianity and is an agent (consciously or unconsciously) of the devil. You condemn anyone treats other theologians or pastors with the same criteria you use for either Aquinas or Calvin. You pick and choose when and how to apply your methodology, because at the end of the day your view is that all four of the men you cited got the Christian faith wrong in some key doctrine. You laud them as brilliant men but at the end of the day, you are the only one of the five of you that has the correct interpretation, correct? Your response to this so far has been to say "All I am doing is sticking with biblical doctrine and Christ." But none of your theological heroes did, according to your yardstick. You alone seem to have the spiritual infallibility you deny that any man can possess. That is... rather remarkable.

Protestant Guy: Let's cut the crap; the crux of the matter is this a fallen world. It's not a GOOD world but a spiritually blinded and depraved world. Jesus was hated, his disciples were hated, and the prophets were hated.... His own people, the Jews hated him.

The biggest fear of the church was to put the Word of God in our hands. With more study came more illumination. Often when errors rose to prominence the record was set straight. We've had the Word longer than any of these men; if these doctrines you mention were so vital there would have been more written that made it into the cannon of scriptures.

Did Jesus not mean the written word to be given unto men? Did he not know what was true and essential????

The biggest offense to Jesus are lukewarm believers, especially those who claim to come in His name and fail to espouse his bold exclusive claims.

This is about sin, our depravity and Jesus as Lord. This offends! We are either for Jesus and against satan or we are not. It's not too difficult unless you want to complicate it. All that other stuff is window dressing. We are either right with God or we have other intentions. Religious humanism says 'we worship the same god,' 'we shouldn't judge (discern!!!),' 'we should bow to the wisdom of the world problem solvers for the good of mankind' – that is your pope! That's who you follow and that's what you need to come to grips with! Why should I make you comfortable with something I believe is an abomination before the Holy God ? I will not do that – Jesus is too important!

Within the faithful presbyterian order, the people keep its leaders honest and scriptures is the final authority and ultimate guide.....

If you are a Christian and not deeply troubled and attacked from the outside (despite your peace in HIM) you may want to reevaluate your faith. I don't understand why people put their faith in an institution or leader above truth.

Catholic Guy stood his ground and I respect that, and the divide will remain as it should! In the end, he will be seen as righteous and compassionate, and I will be seen as radical and dangerous. He will break bread with the likes of Obama and try to negotiate with him and I will wind up in a reeducation camp.

This is how it plays out..... It feels like 'nazi Germany-good-is-bad' all over again.

Where was the papacy during Mussolini and Hitler? Where was his loving influence then?

And where will YOU! stand???


© A.J. Castellitto


The views expressed by RenewAmerica columnists are their own and do not necessarily reflect the position of RenewAmerica or its affiliates.
(See RenewAmerica's publishing standards.)